1. I used to work in a restaurant with a gal that would take the receipts anytime someone left their customer copy. She did exactly this, just lower numbers. They left $30? It was magically $50 when she ran the credit cards. She was also just kind of mean. Not someone I miss working with.

  2. This whole system is madness. In the UK you get your bill, check it over, the server brings the card machine, you either add a tip to the total or leave cash, you bonk the machine with your card never leaving your hand, smiles and thank yous, get on with your day. And I'll get a notification instantly on my phone for the transaction saying how much and where.

  3. Hehe. I always leave the customer receipts with them but I take a photo of the receipt. I delete the receipt after I’ve verified the total. I’m OCD lol.

  4. I had this happen to me. I left a tip but the waitress decided it wasn't enough and then FORGED a larger number.

  5. This is why I take my copy of the receipt and take pictures of the stores copy until the charges clear through correctly.

  6. I knew someone who was fired over doing this but they had only added $1 to the bill. Apparently some old woman came for lunch, didn't tip, and he added $1 probably out of spite. She came in the next day because she always checks her account and keeps her receipts. Pretty open and shut case as far as the manager on duty was concerned.

  7. As a Canadian, it still boggles my mind that the standard practice when paying with card is to hand the card over to the wait staff. Is it not easy for someone to take a photo of your card when they walk back to their station and charge to it later, even if they choose to not scam you immediately?

  8. I’m surprised she was able to get away with that. At my restaurant if there’s a discrepancy in the tip, the manager checks the signed copy that’s been filed and if it’s wrong, the server/bartender pays it back. What she did would never fly anywhere I’ve worked tbh

  9. I have never had to show fraud with Amex business or chase sapphire reserve. Been using both of them for over 5 years. OP- what credit card did you use?

  10. But… without a receipt how do you know who’s fraudent? Should credit card companies just believe the caller no questions asked regardless of the amount?

  11. Definitely. If they are brazen enough to steal 100 dollars for a tip then I'd wonder what else they are doing behind the scenes.

  12. I want the name of the credit card company cause that’s the bigger issue here. There are plenty of instances of fraud where you may not have a receipt and the cc company should be protecting you against that.

  13. It's probably something they do regularly too. As a bar it's easy to see someone's license and identify who is from out of state and therefore it would cost more to come and get a refund than to just let it go. They also probably deal with tourists on a regular basis.

  14. the US system needs to change, the card companies have the technology to have it so that you enter a pin at a p.o.s. system like we have in Canada my card never leaves my sight, I tip on the machine and not on a receipt.

  15. I wonder if OOP forgot to put the S in the $? I did that once at a bar & got charged extra for the $100. Went back the next day and the owner gladly pulled up the receipt & showed me the receipt with the I but no S so it looked like 100 extra dollars. He even pulled up CCTV footage and we watched me sign the receipt, it was taken by the bartender & we went to the end of the night & watched the bartender enter everything into the computer. Sure enough, they never wrote on any receipts. Could have been a goof due to being inebriated?

  16. it’s because he technically had no way to prove it. there are people who try to claim legitimate purchases as fraud to try and get money back.

  17. Common sense from the CC company should be, why did this person tip for double the amount of the original bill? That screams fraud, idk

  18. Shouldn't the credit card company be getting the receipt from the restaurant? This is why they're required to keep their receipts. Yes, it makes it easier if OP has his receipt, but they should be contacting the restaurant and requiring them to provide a receipt or forfeit the money.

  19. My credit card with the worst customer service still refunded me for two years worth of a monthly audible subscription when I said that I had cancelled it and they were still charging me. They refunded every single monthly payment and contacted Audible to get my card taken off file. I cannot imagine OPs situation happening

  20. This was a very common scam back about 10 years ago in areas that had a lot of conventions. I had what was very obviously a business credit card, and I would return back to the office and find generally $1 to $3 added on to at least one of my tabs. I think they assumed that no one would bother to try to fix that or claim it back. They didn't know what pedantic ass hats our accounting team was. I spent hundreds of dollars worth of company time each year fixing $20 to $30 of theft.

  21. Just had a coworker have a server come back and say the card reader wasn’t working, so they paid in cash, still got fully charged on the card. Shit is ridiculous.

  22. This is why we always take the guest copy with us when we leave and then shred them. My husband works in a bank and he doesn't play with leaving financial information lying around.

  23. How do i get a receipt if someone use my credit card number for fraud? With their logic they never need to pay back everything.

  24. Because OP approved a partial amount. Fraud means they stole your information, how did they steal his information if part of the charge is legitimate?

  25. Give a 1 star review on google/facebook/etc. Those things get noticed for bars and restaurants. Their fault for not answering you.

  26. Because it’s not financially profitable for them to change it. That’s the only reason, it costs money to switch to new ways so they just stick with the old ones and pretend like they can’t afford it.

  27. It blew my mind when I was visiting Atlanta and the server looked at me like I had two heads when I asked her to bring the machine over so I could pay

  28. Yeah it’s so weird! I remember having a lot of American customers and them not using a pin or contactless payment. I don’t get it, why are they so behind in card payments? And here in Europe taking a customer’s card for payment is generally not allowed.

  29. Heh, surprising how many places in the UK will tell you the total and hold out the contactless machine and I'm like "brother I can't see the amount on the screen", and they're like ?????

  30. There was a restaurant I went to that did this to me, and I wish I wasn't so lazy, but it was $5.00. It annoyed me because I tipped more with cash. Now, I write "Cash" instead of using zeroes. They lost a customer and potential lunch business. They went out of business, but they had an amazing white chocolate caramel bread pudding!

  31. This is why the US is so behind in banking. Paper checks, receipts for credit cards.... come on it's not 1980. Get on the digital banking I mean you guys invented the internet! Everything should be run through the machines so stuff like this doesn't happen. The fact that banks still have customers fill out paper deposit slips is laughable.

  32. Is it an American thing to give someone else your card and they process the payment. I’m just a little confused, I think I may have seen this sort of thing in a movie, quite a foreign concept to me. Or am I out the ballpark entirely?

  33. In America they still do that super old school thing where they give you a receipt that you hand write the tip amount and sign it, then I guess they process whatever you put down? It really confused me when I was visiting there recently and they were still doing that: I don't think I've had to do that where I live for the past 15 years or so.

  34. Yeah, it definitely feels pretty American, I have never heard of the "pay by just giving your card to a random person who will totally for real charge you the correct amount of money, no you can't see what they're doing with your card or how much they're charging, good luck" thing anywhere else.

  35. It sort of blows me away. I’m Canadian and the thought of someone taking my card is wild. Hell, for years now when I do a transaction with my bank/cc I get a text and app notification of what I spent and where I spent it. Fraud claims are also insanely easy. I’ve even had my bank claw back money from companies because the company themselves wouldn’t honour their return policy.

  36. Fuck. I'm going to make sure I keep my receipts - I get email notifications as soon as the balance is charged to my card though to catch this sort of thing. Do you not have that programmed in?

  37. They run your card right away for your base bill (to make sure it's an active credit card). So a notification for that won't help.

  38. I use a Capital One card as my main credit card and the app will alert me if it thinks there's been a double charge or if a tip is excessively large (I assume they compare the initial charge with no tip to the final charge) so the technology exists to catch this type of fraud.

  39. Was about to post this same thing before finding your comment, I worked in tipping industry jobs through my teens and early adulthood so I’m a generous tipper.

  40. If you're an American and this happens: file a police report for theft. I'd have the cops meet me at the restaurant to take the complaint. Files a complaint with your states attorney general against both the restaurant and credit card company. File fraud complaint with the CFPB because this was not just theft but bank fraud too.

  41. Yah I’ve had zero issues with my credit card voiding transactions for fraud, which is what this is when a server lies on the amount. I use an Amex though and since I fly a ton I’ve got their platinum so maybe that helps a ton.

  42. I take photos of my receipt after I've put the tip amount on and totalled everything. I can just delete it later.

  43. This is very much what blasting them on every review site is for. That bartender has definitely done that to others.

  44. Took me too long to find this comment. The burden of proof is with the merchant, never the consumer. Surprise so many people don't know how it works...

  45. Willing to bet it's Discover card. They claim they're a financial service company not a credit card so the rules don't apply to them.

  46. I don't believe it was Capital One - if you leave a large tip, they send you an alert asking to confirm you did that or not.

  47. Did OP really not name and shame the CC company?? Rude. Don’t let the rest of us find out the hard way :/

  48. This just isn't possible in other parts of the world due to having to enter a pin. We can't swipe a card or sign. Bit draconian with all these issues?

  49. I find it absolutely mind boggling that in the US the tip is still filled out by hand. In Canada we add the tip on the credit card terminal.

  50. I went out for drinks and the bartender was a cool dude, even brought me a shot to share with him, was a chocolate coffee something or other. Needless to say I was pretty toasted when he brought me my bill that had those two shots added, and two meals I didn’t order. It took .2 seconds for him to know what I was talking about when I showed him the bill. Check your receipts people

  51. I once had a company charge me $500 over what the contract said I owed. Even with the contract in-hand, Citizens Bank took every opportunity to try and side with the merchant. It took 6 months and multiple appeals for them to finally give me my money back.

  52. This same fact pattern is why I always take a quick phone picture of the receipt with the tip amount, total, and signature before I hand it to them. The actual one that I'm giving them, not the customer copy.

  53. I always write my added tip and totals to both merchant and customer copy. Then take a picture of both of them. I had an issue like this once before and sure enough, it was resolved by providing picture proof.

  54. I hate to say it but this is when you sue your cc company. You have to escalate past the customer service people, and the legal department will get shit done with a quickness. I had a similar-but-not-the-same issue with a charge not getting refunded properly. Customer service stonewalled me for SIX MONTHS. I filed a small claim and the company’s legal department had it sorted out within hours of being served.

  55. What kind of CC company is this?I have never had an issue like this occur but in previous disputes my CC has never asked for receipts.

  56. This didn't make any sense. If the bar refuses to give out receipts, than no one can deny any charges with this cc company... that's just insane. "They refuse to give me a copy of my receipt", and you're fucked? Lmfao.

  57. sorry if this is a naive question, but what is the point of 'keeping the card active' instead of just canceling it? Something to do with credit score or some bullshit?

  58. Yes, probably has to do with the credit score. There's a concept on credit reports that deals with aging. Basically, they take the average age of all of your credit card accounts that are open. The higher that average is, the better it is for your credit score because it means that you've had credit for a longer period of time. If he closes this account and it's one of his oldest it could shorten the age of his credit, which could lowers credit score.

  59. What if the dispute includes the lack of a receipt. Do you need a receipt to prove that you did not get a receipt.

  60. We had this happen a very long time ago. But it was solved practically instantaneously because carbon copies were used back then and my parents kept the original receipt (they keep everything). Nowadays it’s different since you just fill in your customer copy separately (for your own records). Although I still think it’s odd that the OOP thinks proof of receipt was a completely stupid request.

  61. It is though because the customer copy is not a carbon copy of the restaurant copy. A carbon copy would be proof, but I’ve never seen that. It’s always two separate receipts. The only one that matters is the restaurant copy. Even if OP kept their copy, it proves nothing.

  62. If only there were little devices they could bring to the table /bar and let the customer confirm everything on it before it runs.

  63. Wtf... as a bar manager I once spent 45 minutes going through old receipts to prove to a customer that they did tip TEN DOLLARS. Turns out, I should have just gotten rid of our phones.

  64. I always take a photo of the receipt. It helped me in a similar situation and the offender was fired as a result. (I declined to press charges; in hindsight, perhaps I should've).

  65. I used with work a middle aged coke head who did this with his tips. I tried reporting it to our manager, but he refused to do anything about it. I didn't stay there long and I never worked as a server again.

  66. As someone who works in the service industry, I know how this works. You (the guest) make a report to your bank/cc company. They WILL ask you to go through the business to try to resolve. If that does not work (or the company asks you to go through the formal process) then it CAN take up to 30 days to resolve. The company HAS to provide proof on their end (not the guest) of the contested amount. I have dealt with this many times as a manager and a few as a guest who made the complaint.

  67. As someone who works in disputes I have so many questions. I deal with MasterCard and we have a non-fraud dispute just to deal with excessive tips.

  68. New Yorker and nightlife worker here… bars in this city are really sensitive to yelp so leave a review about what happened. ALSO… file a complaint with the Better Business Bureau and mention you did in your review. The BBB is a complaint no one wants to deal with. You should report them to the liquor board and IRS too, you’re not the only one.

  69. This is why it’s so important to take the customer receipt. My mom taught me this. When I first met my husband, he didn’t know that you’re supposed to take the customer receipt and would leave it. After being together for closer to a decade, he still too often forgets. I sent him a screenshot of the post as a reminder why it’s so important. 😅

  70. I think you might to expose the bar. At least on social media. How many others have been scammed like this by that bar tender? You could help a lot of potential future victims by speaking up

  71. This is covered under regulation Z as “charged more than authorized”. So often, bank employees (or 3rd party overseas contractors) don’t know the right way to categorize specific claims, and they get denied on principle because they don’t belong in the departments where they end up.

  72. Similarly, I bought a computer from best buy that was completely dead after 15 days. Best Buy's return policy is 14 days, and the manufacturer takes 6-8 weeks to issue refurbished replacements IF they decide the device is actually broken. I'm out $3k

  73. The use of credit score in the United States is detrimental to any normal person, that you should have to keep up with a service that doesn't work so that your mystery number that determines your value doesn't inexplicably go down.

  74. OOP should have filed a police report. Even if the police do nothing about it (which is likely), the police report is a legal document that the CC company has to accept as legit. That probably would have made them do what they should have done from the get-go. An incident like that could also impact the bar’s ability to use that credit card company in the future.

  75. One of my cards text me that a tip was suspicious and to confirm it, and here your's sits telling you to FO.

  76. I had an issue with my Best Buy credit card a couple years ago. I basically only kept in in case I needed to make an emergency appliance purchase or something for Black Friday, because the deal APR was 0% for 24 months, but regular apr was like 24%, so I wouldn’t ever carry a balance. Well, I decided to preorder a game from them, just to put a little usage on the card since I hadn’t bought anything in years. When I found out they’d be shipping me the game regular mail on release day (so getting to me a week later) instead of having it delivered to me to play on release day, I canceled the order. The game came anyways, so I sent it back. They didn’t remove the charge, and I haven’t got bills from them in forever and no bill ever came, so obviously I didn’t notice. They charged me $60 for the game, and something like $100 in late fees before they started sending emails and calling me about past due balances. It took 2 months worth of calls and e-mails to get the charges removed. At one point one of the fraud department employees canceled my 15-20 year old account, created a new one, and transferred the balance to it, completely ruining my tenure with the card while keeping the problem. All that headache for a $60 game that I’d tried to preorder.

  77. That’s crazy!! One time a bartender switched a $2 tip to $20 and my credit card flagged it and even emailed me over it because the percentage of the tip was so high compared to the bill (2 beers at a dive bar a few years ago). They removed it without question. I wouldn’t have even noticed tbh bc they didn’t go crazy with abusing the tip line.

  78. Man I worked for a major top 10 bank as a retail service manager and can tell you this response is bullshit. Never once needed a receipt. Shit like this happens all the time for a 100 bucks the bank would even blink an eye on an a account that doesn't have previous or long standing history of claiming fraud. We would close the card as op said. Refund the purchase as fraud and handle it from there.

  79. I wouldn't even care about the hit to my credit. I'd close the account anyway and tell anyone who would listen why.

  80. As someone who had multiple cards stolen and ran up multiple transactions in $7000 of purchasing game consoles and electronics from Best Buy, Walmart, Target , and game stop. I can tell you with 100% certainty, nobody fucking cares. The police do nothing, and will lie to you, the stores do nothing and will lie. The credit card companies have slush funds, from charging fees and shit they use to balance their books after they refund you. Credit card fraud is a huge business for thieves and nobody does shit about it. I even managed to get camera footage from target and showed the cops matching pictures of the person I know who stole my cards and they straight up would not do anything but lie to my face and refuse to do shit. Target was the only retailer that worked with me until the police threatened them.

  81. I'm not surprised the hotel next door told them to bugger off lol, I wouldn't want to get involved either when I'm just trying to do my hotel job. Fuck the server tho, they sound like a dick.

  82. I want to know how having a receipt proves that you didn't tip $100, since the tip is written in AFTER the receipt is printed. No bar gives a final receipt showing what you tipped, so your only "proof" would be whatever you wrote on your copy of the receipt. So stupid.

  83. You def have to take your copy and either write CASH, zero or a zero with a strike through it on the tip line if you are leaving cash. And ALWAYS take your receipt! Use the dollar symbol to ensure there is no space to write a 1 in front of your original tip number (i.e. 3 becomes $13.) Learned this working in a restaurant as a kid. Years later, someone ran a $30 tip on a $30 bill and then tried to say it wasn't fraud and just submitted their copy of the receipt. . I pulled out my copy of the receipt with the original tip ($6.) They disputed it three times but I won in the end.

  84. As a Canadian I always get really nervous in the states when some random stranger just walks away with my card. Why is it like that in the US? Why not just bring the machine to the customer so there’s no chance someone pulls the kind of thing OOP experienced?

  85. Why are they even bothering to keep the account active with the subscription? I’d just close my account, fuck this company.

  86. I don’t know why they said “technically is not fraud” the fuck it is. You got robbed! They authorized a charge you didn’t consent to. I will cancel my card! Fuck them. I’ve never had a problem about things like these. Bank always backs me up.

  87. I had this happen. I was able to get the restaurant yo refund my money though and the person was fired. I did keep my receipt though. I always do when eating out just for this reason.

  88. LPT: Use a Visa gift card for the bar. Load it up with your allowance. Protect yourself from fraud, theft, and your own lack of inhibition.

  89. Make sure you leave a google review for them. At least the money they steal from others will be taken from them in lost patronage. Some people don't realise how much business rely on this, and letting these types of businesses get away with it is why customer service and unethical trade is going to the shit.

  90. Had this happen at a restaurant I worked at but it was literally 50 cents more. I honestly think the server just typed it in wrong because who would risk their job for such a small amount? The guy actually came in for the refund and wanted to make sure the server was “dealt with” whatever that means. The manager just took the two quarters out of his own pocket to avoid the hassle.

  91. Hmm chase is good with fraud stuff and I haven’t had a situation where they asked me for a receipt but unsure in a situation like this

  92. Idk about this particular case but Bank of America is unbelievable trash. I ALWAYS work with more regional banks now.

  93. .. Huh? Why is the receipt needed? I have never needed a receipt to do a reverse charge on any of my cards or bank accounts. Even after they refunded me the money, I would have turned around and filed a complaint anyways.

  94. Cheques are extinct in my country. Bank transfers happen in 30 seconds or less, paywave and Google wallet/apple pay is king and cash in hand is an endangered form of currency atm. Blows my mind that the US is still so far behind with money and bank tech

  95. I’m the most shocked at the bar not having a phone/number. In NYC. Where anyone might need to contact them for any reason 🤧

  96. I remember switching credit cards when Capital One failed to mail me a bill for 3 months in a row. Being a college student and having a lot going on, I didn't think about it at the time. And this was early 2000s.

  97. When I was waiting tables in the 80s we had a guy do this on multiple receipts. Not sure how many but I know it wasn't as much per charge.

  98. This post really bugs me. I hate the tipping system, even as someone who benefited from it for years.

  99. This is why it’s so important to keep your receipts! I get not wanting papers everywhere, but at least take a quick picture of the signed receipt with the tip filled out before handing it over. Will save you in the long run.

  100. OF COURSE you need a receipt, that's just plain ol' common sense. You just learned an important lesson about being an adult. Receipts are given out for a reason.

  101. “Why don’t people go out to eat, give tip give 30 percent tip takeout is killing my income!!” at this point eating out is basically having someone shake a coin jar at me while coughing onto my mislabeled food half the time, no wonder fewer people are doing it.

  102. Almost all major banks issue their credit cards through either the Visa or Mastercard network, each of which has their own (though similar) set of extensive guidelines and processes for disputing transactions, including what documentation is needed for each side to impose liability. Every bank using those networks has to follow these guidelines as part of their agreement with the network, though they may also make their own internal policies regarding to what extent they may extend "good will credits" for situations where they have no standing to continue a dispute to arbitration but still believe the customer should be made whole, like they did in your situation.

  103. Same happened to me at some shit hole bar in Des Moines while working. Somehow I caught it, unfortunately I don't check my receipts as often as I should. I flipped shit and demanded the difference in cash. The bartender was quick with it. Not sure if it was an honest mistake or she didn't want her manager seeing. Either way I was hot but had my money back

  104. ugh step 1, cancel the card and get a new one. my credit card company has always been helpful in situations like this--even if the actual policy doesn't make it easy, they've found ways to help me problem solve.

  105. go back in time and move to a country where you have to enter a pin after verifying the amount charged to process payment

  106. I feel rude doing it, but this is exactly why when they hand me the bill to sign I write in the exact total and then cross out the tip.

  107. America has a bonkers system. This was the system about 30 years ago in India, when I moved here I was massively shocked that it's still so backwards here.

  108. should we all write longform and shortform on the receipts? (ie, $20 - twenty dollars)....or idk, that still wouldn't have helped OP but maybe bartender would have hesitated

  109. I'm always really careful with how I complete a tipped rceipt. I makes sure to leave NOSPACEATALL between the dollar sign ($) and any digits I write. I've even been thinking about writing words instead of using digits, like with a personal check. Having now read an example of this happening, I may just start doing that, if just to make my kids think I'm a bigger dork than they already believe (know) me to be.

  110. I wish I could remember which card it was, but I had a credit card company do the opposite. I was a regular at a neighborhood bar and had befriended all the bartenders. I was going to give them Christmas gift cards but realized last minute I didn't bring the cards with me so I overtipped them instead. Since there were 4 of them it was $100 on top of the normal tip, way more than the bill total.

  111. This totally happened to my husband while we were at a bar. Fortunately, we disputed with the credit card company when the bar didn’t care. Credit card company was great and we didn’t get charged.

  112. Years ago I had this happen to me, but it wasnt $100, it was lke $2. I only noticed as I always tipped to an even number, and when my transaction went through it was not.

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